The Congressional Globe: Containing the Debates and Proceedings of the Second Session Forty-Second Congress; With an Appendix, Embracing the Laws Passed at that Session Page: 3,597
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1872.
THE CONGRESSIONAL GLOBE.
359?
incidental expenses of the quartermaster's
department from $1,250,000 to $1,200,000.
The amendment was agreed to.
The next amendment was on page 4, line
eighty-seven, to reduce the appropriation for
purchase of horses for the cavalry and artillery,
and for Indian scouts, and for such infantry as
may be mounted, from $450,000 to $300,000.
The amendment was agreed to.
The next amendment was on page 5, in
line one hundred and twelve, to reduce the
appropriation for transportation of the Army
from $4,000,000 to $3,500,000.
The amendment was agreed to.
The next amendment was on page 6, line
one hundred and thirteen, after the word "dol-
lars," to insert:
And section nine of the act of March 3,1871, en-
titled " An act making appropriations for the sun-
port of the Army for the year ending June 30,
1872, and for other purposes," is hereby repealed.
Mr. STEWART. I object to concurring in
that amendment. It is not in order under the
rule.
The VICE PRESIDENT. The Senator
will state upon what he bases the point of
order.
Mr. STEWART. It is new matter. It is
the repeal of another law. It is independent
legislation, general legislation—legislation of
the most general kind, repealing a declaratory
act passed last year.
The VICE PRESIDENT. The Senator
from Nevada makes a point of order on the
amendment at, the top of page 6 of the bill that
it is not within the restrictive rule adopted on
the 29th of April.
Mr. COLE. Mr. President
The VICE PRESIDENT. Does the Sena-
tor from California desire to be heard upon it ?
Mr. COLE. Yes, sir ; briefly.
Mr. CON KLIN G. Is the point of order
debatable ?
The VICE PRESIDENT. It is not, if any
Senator insists upon the enforcement of the
rule.
Mr. CONKLING. Then let us go on with
the regular order. I hope the Senator from
California will not set the example of violating
the rule.
Mr. COLE. This clause of the bill relates
to transportation, and the amendment relates
to the same subject.
Mr. CONKLING. Let the Chair decide
the question.
Mr. CASSERLY. It is impossible for the
Senate to know, and I think difficult for the
Presiding Officer to know, whether there is
any point of order in this amendment without
knowing what it means.
The VICE PRESIDENT. The Chair will
state it. The point must be decided by the
Chair or submitted to the Senate upon its
being made without debate preliminary to that
decision.
Mr. CASSERLY. I think section nine of
the act of March 3, 1871, ought to be read.
Mr. CONKLING-. My honorable friend
from California is not in order. I do not like
to call him to order, butheknows that a point
of order is not debatable.
Mr. CASSERLY. I might call the Senator
from New York to order for addressing the
Chair or a brother Senator in his seat; but I
will not do that.
The VICE PRESIDENT. The Senator
from Nevada makes the point of order that
this amendment is not within the restrictive
rule adopted by the Senate on the 29th of
April, 1872. Section nine of the act of March
3, 1871, entitled "An act making appropria-
tions for the support of the Army for the year
ending June 30, 1872, and for other pur-
poses," which it is proposed to absolutely
repeal, was a section in regard to the construc-
tion of the act granting bonds to the Pacific
railroad in regard to the repayment of interest.
The Chair remembers historically about it, as
the Senate remembers historically about it. It
declared that the true meaning of the act
granting bonds to the various Pacific railroads
was that one half of the amount of transporta-
tion, &c., should be paid in cash bythe United
States, and the other half should be credited
as interest upon the bonds. The Chair thinks
that is the substance of the section, but if
any Senator desires it, it can be reported.
Mr. SHERMAN. Let it be reported.
Mr. MORRILL, of Vermont, and others.
Oh, no ; that is all there is of it.
Mr. ANTHONY. Mr. President
The VICE PRESIDENT. The Chair has
not yet made a decision,
Mr. ANTHONY. I was going to make a
suggestion previous to the decision if I may
be allowed to do so. The bill is now in Com-
mittee of the Whole. Would it not be well
to pass over this amendment for the present,
and consider it when the bill comes into the
Senate?
Mr. STEWART. No.
Mr. ANTHONY. We shall hardly be able
to pass the bill to-night. The Senator from
Vermont, [Mr. Edmonds,] who is now absent
and has gone home ill, feels a considerable
interest in this matter. I think this amend-
ment had better be deferred until he can be
here; that is to say, if the bill is not to pass
to-night, as I suppose it is not.
Mr. COLE. 1 think out of courtesy to the
Senator from Vermont, who I know feels an
interest on the subject, we ought to pass over
the amendment until we get into the Senate.
The VICE PRESIDENT. Does the Sena-
torfrom Nevada withdraw the point of order?
Mr. STEWART. No. I shall not.
Mr. SAWYER. Mr. President
Mr. CONKLING. Let us have the regular
order.
The VICE PRESIDENT. The Senator from
New York demands the regular order. The
Chair must therefore either submit this ques-
tion to the Senate, and leave it open to debate,
or decide it.
Mr. SAWYER. Is it in order to make a
motion for an executive session?
The VICE PRESIDENT. It is.
Mr. CONKLING. While the Chair is in
the act of deciding the point of order? I
insist that the Chair having risen to announce
his decision on the point of order which has
been raised, the Senator from South Carolina
cannot make his motion. Let us know first
whether this amendment is to be considered
or not.
The VICE PRESIDENT. The Chair sus-
tains the point made by the Senator from New
York, that the point of order must be decided,
and the Chair has risen to make that decision
if Senators will allow him to do so. The re-
strictive rule of the 29th April, 1872, reads as
follows:
"Resolved, Thatdurins the present sessionit, shall
be in order at any time to move a recess, and pend-
ing an appropriation bill, to move to confine debate
on amendments thereto to five minutes by any Sen-
ator on the pendins motion, anil such motions shall
be decided withoutdebate. And no amendment to
any such bill making legislative provisions, other
than such as directly relate to the appropriations
contained in the bill, shall be received.'
The first time that a construction was given
this rule, on a question that admitted a good
deal of argument, was when the naval appro-
priation bill was pending before the Senate
some two or three weeks ago. The Senator
from New Jersey, [Mr. Stockton,J not now
in his seat, moved an amendment that the
salaries of certain officers named, provided
for in the naval appropriation bill, should be
increased. A point of order was made upon
it—the Chair does not remember at this mo-
ment distinctly by whom it was made—that
the amendment was not in order under this
restrictive rule, because it was a permanent
increase of salary to these officers, and this
rule states that "no amendment to any such
bill making legislative provisions, other than
such as directly relate to the appropriations
contained in the bill, shall be received." The
Senator from Rhode Island [Mr. Anthony]
was then in the chair, and gave his opinion,
and the Chair thinks, concurring in the point
of order, that the permanent increase of a
salary, even for an officer named in the ap-
propriation bill, was not within this rule, but
he subsequently submitted the question to the
Senate. It was assented to on discussion in
the Senate. The Senator from New Jersey
then qualified his proposition so that the salary
should be raised for the fiscal year for which
the appropriation bill operates, and in that
condition, the Chair thinks, it was agreed to
after debate.
This amendment, repealing section nine of
the act of March 3, 1871, is an absolute repeal,
not, for this year but for all time, of a legisla-
tive provision. The Chair thinks, if that
decision on the naval appropriation bill be
correct on the amendment proposed by the Sen-
ator from New Jersey, that an officer's salary,
although the officer might be named in the
appropriation bill, could not be permanently
increased, but only for one year under this
restrictive rule, as the appropriation bill is in
opperation but one year, and that decision
seemed to be assented to by the Senate, this
absolute repeal for all time of the section of
the law of 1871, here referred to, would fall
within the" same inhibition. But as this is a
restrictive rule the Chair would prefer, if any
Senator desires it, to submit the question to
the Senate whether the amendment be in order
or not, so that he can have a decision of the
Senate for his guidance hereafter.
Several SenatokS. No, no; the decision
is clearly right.
Mr. BOREMAN. I rise to make an in-
quiry. I understand this amendment was re-
ported by the Committee on Appropriations.
Does the Chair hold that the rule read applies
to amendments reported by a committee?
The VICE PRESIDENT. Unquestionably.
A committee, after this rule was adopted,
could no more offer an amendment out of
order than an individual Senator could, for it
reads:
"And no amendment to any such bill making legis-
lative provisions, other than such as directly ielates
to appropriations contained in the bill, shall be re-
ceived."
It would be incompetent for the Senate to
receive an amendment conflicting with this
rule, whether it came from a committee or a
Senator.
Mr. BOREMAN. Even if it is reported in
the regular way from the committee having
charge of the bill?
Mr. CONKLING. Let me remind my hon-
orable friend that before the rule was adopted,
upon my own request, the Vice President
stated that the rule would undoubtedly apply to
amendments from committees as well as from
anybody else. I put that question in the first
place that we might vote understandingly, and
that was stated clearlv from the chair.
Th<j VICE PRESIDENT. The Chair will
add furthermore that at the time he statedjhat
the Morrill amendment, so called, having then
been received by the Senate and debated and
banging upon a motion to reconsider, would
not be within the inhibition. But this amend-
ment appears to have been reported on the 9th
of May, and the restrictive rule was adopted
on the 29t,h day of April.
Mr. SAWYER. I rose to make a motion,
but, I will yield to the Senator from California.
Mr. COLE. If an appeal irom the Chair
opens this matter to debate——
The VICE PRESIDENT. An appeal would
not be necessary. If any Senator desires the
Senate to decide this question, the Chair will
submit it to the Senate himself. He will
regaid this only as the expression of an opin-
ion based upon a previous decision of the
Senate. If the Senator from California desirps
it to be submitted to the Senate, the Chair will
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United States. Congress. The Congressional Globe: Containing the Debates and Proceedings of the Second Session Forty-Second Congress; With an Appendix, Embracing the Laws Passed at that Session, book, 1872; Washington D.C.. (https://digital.library.unt.edu/ark:/67531/metadc30899/m1/17/: accessed April 24, 2024), University of North Texas Libraries, UNT Digital Library, https://digital.library.unt.edu; crediting UNT Libraries Government Documents Department.